Big D - You owe me money.

[Chuck]

About 2.5 months ago Big D and myself made a deal for him to buy a 21" Warden. He was going to pay me some money up front, and then the rest as soon as he got it. So the deal was made, and being a friend a teammate, I offered to build him a box as long as he paid for the materials for the box. Box build started around 10am, and then it was ready to play late that night. We go to play the sub and after a bit of messing with it, it started making a weird buzzing noise and shooting sparks. Upon cutting the cone out we found a huge burn in the coil. Almost like it shorted out on something.

So since the deal was for a used, but 100% functional sub, I paid for a recone kit and labor to have it reconed out of pocket. At this point, Im losing money on the sub, as I bought it to flip it and make a a few bucks. I may have been in the red, but D was a friend, and he had my word the sub was 100% functional, so I was obligated to deliver the product as promised. Within the next day or two I ordered the recone kit, paying out of pocket to help a friend. It was shipped from IA and then was rebuilt.

When the sub was ready, D came to my house to pick it up. At this point I recieved $200 towards the sub, out of the agreed upon price of $600. I installed the sub into the box, and give it a test. It was much louder than it was the night we first hooked it up. I played all types of music for about 10 mins. Sub wasnt warm, and showed no signs of stress. It was playing beautifully, and sounded great. After that, he goes on his way. That day/night he was posting on the forum in his build log how great it sounded, how loud it was, guessing numbers it was doing, and seemed overall very happy with the sub.

The next day I get a call from him saying that something broke and it wont play anymore. He didnt have a DMM to test it, so I told him to test for continuity with a 9v battery. He tried it, and said there was nothing. Later when the sub is cut apart, it is shown that the motor and everything is completely fine, and the point of failure was the cooked voice coils. They metered the subs coils and found a coil to be dead.

At this point, D is telling me he doesnt want to deal with the sub anymore and will give me the sub back if I give him his $200 back. Being that it was delivered with a fresh recone, and in 100% condition, I am not taking a blown speaker back. I told Big D that a deal is a deal, and he owes me the other $400 for the speaker as I need the cash to fund other things.

He claims that there is something wrong with the speaker itself, which is why it doesnt work. He says that he absolutely did not blow it, but the black, toasted, open coil says otherwise. There is only one way that a coil can become black like that, misuse. I wont pay for ANOTHER recone for someone who blows a sub they bought from me, but he claims that he absolutely 100% did not blow the sub, and its a problem with the sub that caused it to not play.

As far as Im concerned, the deal stands. He has paid me $200, and I expect another $400 for the sub. After I get paid, it can be sold, reconed, etc. It doesnt matter, as its not my sub. There was a handshake and he gave me his word he wanted the sub and would pay me as soon as he got the money. Now 2.5 months down the road he is backing out and will not pay. He insists that I just get the sub back and resell it. I fronted the money for this sub, then paid for the recone. I dont want my money out there for another possible couple weeks/months, as I need it to buy other things.

D, it sucks that we couldnt settle this any other way, and I needed to post this, but a deal is a deal. Im tired of arguing with you. All a man has is his word, and breaking your word is the lowest thing you can do. We made a deal to buy the sub, and it was shaken on. Now Id appreciate it if you just held up your end of the deal.

Edited in: Pics of coil can be found in post # 90 in the link below.

http://www.floridaspl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13768&page=9

[Chuck]

This the sub that was sold to you blown from previous owner,who didn't tell you sub was f'ed?

Yes. Got screwed once on it. Now getting screwed again. Awesome.

And Robin did the recone. Sub played flawlessly after I put it in.

[Chuck]

ok the whole story. sounds to me like an inproper box design, and or power issue, or missuse .,if in this case I where big d, a deal is a deal bro. sorry, and you know I dont even like gmonk to well.

I bought 2 15s from a guy, and put 1000 watts on them. they are 2k ea subs. played them ok. went home put a second amp on them, and the cone ripped in half. found a small mark were it was hit with a screw driver . since it tested fine in front of him, and i left playing it, it was mine I reconed it, and didnt say a word . this stuff is like a race car. every run down the track you risk blowing up something, and every once in a while shizz happens.

The box worked great. The amp was fine too. I played it for a while at my house and there was no problem at all.

When you try to get loud, stuff will break. Thats no reason to back out of a deal and screw a "friend" over.

[Big D]

Today, 02:20 PM
galacticmonkey
Senior Member
FloridaSPL Addict




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 7,825
Re: Yoooo

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I either want the sub back with a fresh recone, where you can have your money back.

Or ill take the blown sub back, in which case I'm keeping the $200 to cover the recone/labor/etc.

Third option is you pay me the last $400 for the sub and make good on the deal that we agreed upon months ago.

[Big D]

looks like you will be getting number 1 and 2 that you wanted.

[Chuck]

looks like you will be getting number 1 and 2 that you wanted.


No. I will be getting full payment for the sub. Dont even act like youre getting screwed because there is another recone on the way, that Ill give to you upon full payment of the sub.

I dont want the sub AND your money. I just want the money. The sub is yours, as per the deal we made 2.5 months ago.

[Chuck]

wow you paid $600 for 1 used sub f that

Warden 21s go used for anywhere from $700-800. New, they are about $1000. The $600 price for what ended up being basically a brand new sub is a heck of a deal.

I dont see why he wont make good on his deal. If he pays me the $400, the sub will be his, and he can sell for the $600 that he paid for it. Then he can sell the box to someone else with a Grand Marquis/Crown Vic or any sort of SUV. He paid materials, and I built for free. He would most likely make money selling the box on Craigslist or a Crown Vic forum.

Dont even act like youre getting screwed on this deal.

[Big D]

No. I will be getting full payment for the sub. Dont even act like youre getting screwed because there is another recone on the way, that Ill give to you upon full payment of the sub.

I dont want the sub AND your money. I just want the money. The sub is yours, as per the deal we made 2.5 months ago.

Today, 02:20 PM
galacticmonkey
Senior Member
FloridaSPL Addict




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 7,825
Re: Yoooo

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I either want the sub back with a fresh recone, where you can have your money back.

Or ill take the blown sub back, in which case I'm keeping the $200 to cover the recone/labor/etc.
Third option is you pay me the last $400 for the sub and make good on the deal that we agreed upon months ago.

[Big D]

idk man he has been a good friend and rly helped me out. did you not say u wernt gonna pay him?

yes i did with the understanding that the sub was 100% whats to say another recone won't go bad? then what im stuck?

[Big D]

the subs has issues

[Big D]

curious why a TEAM CAPTAIN would get this you got my number and we been pming all day....

[Big D]

why cant you just pay the money that you agreed upon 2.5 months ago? why were you trying to sell the sub before you even finished paying it off?:nono: that is scammer type status.

dude you don't have a clue....myob!

[Big D]

well even say d is wrong for not payin. if its worth all that. give him $100 for the box ,and sell it yourself for $ 700. at tax time it should go fast.

the box is paid for and a loss im taking....

[Big D]

the chance that you will repeatedly get bad recones from IA is slim..

thats a chance i won't be taking.

[Big D]

in my opinion this needs to be taken to pms/phonecall...too many people butting in that have no buisness nor know the whole story.
This threads just having fuel thrown on the fire by outsiders.

110% correct!

[Big D]

curious why a team captain would get this you got my number and we been pming all day....

can i get answer????????

[Chuck]

Wow man this in uncalled for we could have talked it out Sunday. The real problem is when u sold him the sub it wasn't working because u accepted it in bad shape really. No real power was put on the sub to see if it was working 100% in the beginning. When there was it proved to be a dud. Im trying to figure out where he stiffed u hes out money on a box 200 dollars and the sub gets a free recone because for somereason there may have been a problem with the recones i saw the sub and it looked wierd as hell. Not like someone just blew it for ****s n giggles the one that should be called out is mumbler but i dont see that.

Im tired of waiting, Ive been waiting for 2.5 months. It wasworking when he first got it, but after about 5 mins of playing, it started shooting sparks in the port, so I figured it was on its way out. Either way, I wouldnt have wanted to pay for a sub and get that result. So i paid for a recone, and delivered on my side. I figured he was a friend, and I had to keep my word. It cost me money, but Id rather be a stand up guy and keep a good reputation than screw a friend over for a couple hundred bucks.

He has money into a box that I built for him for free. That has nothing to do with this deal. That was just to show that I was truly trying to help a friend out.

The coil was black and didnt read. Thats a blown coil. Nothing will cause that. Not bad glue, not a shifted motor, not a ripped or torn cone, not a jacked up spyder, not a bad surround, not a demagnetized motor, nothing. Only thing that will cause a burnt coil is misuse, whether its a clipped signal, or just flat out too much power. Since I was playing it for a bit with no problem on the AP 3k, I couldnt have been the subs fault. If it was the amp, radio, wiring, RCAs, etc that blew it, I am not liable. The speaker was wired correctly, and played wonderfully when it left here. Anything past that is Ds responsibility, since there was no problem with the sub at all.

I dealt with Mumbler when the first part happened. In the end, he sold a used sub, and I bought it as is. We hooked it up at first and it played fine for a bit, until problems started. We did quite a bit of playing it before it started rattling and sparking. Drew was there, he remembers how we played it fine at first.

Im accounted for, and Mumbler is accounted for. Only person with an obligation thats needs to be fulfilled is D.

Because Nick at IA is such a standup guy, youre even getting ANOTHER recone for the sub. Maybe third time is the charm. All youre paying in this entire event is materials for a box (which you were going to pay no matter what you bought, so it cant be counted), and $600 on a sub. You havent paid for a single recone, and dont have any money on the table that you werent expecting to. I was thinking of just taking the sub back, but I dont want to find another buyer and possibly wait another 2.5 months to get paid. I want my money for this sub now.

You made a deal with me, and Nick and myself have gone ABOVE AND BEYOND to help you out. Now I would like to recieve payment for the product that was delivered.

[Big D]

i dont have a clue? so you weren't trying to sell the sub as a blown sub just shortly after you got it in the car?

the sub was put in my car played at 1/4 volume maybe 5 times and stopped working....no smelly coils. then i offered it as recone needed.

[Big D]

Im tired of waiting, Ive been waiting for 2.5 months. It wasworking when he first got it, but after about 5 mins of playing, it started shooting sparks in the port, so I figured it was on its way out. Either way, I wouldnt have wanted to pay for a sub and get that result. So i paid for a recone, and delivered on my side. I figured he was a friend, and I had to keep my word. It cost me money, but Id rather be a stand up guy and keep a good reputation than screw a friend over for a couple hundred bucks.

He has money into a box that I built for him for free. That has nothing to do with this deal. That was just to show that I was truly trying to help a friend out.

The coil was black and didnt read. Thats a blown coil. Nothing will cause that. Not bad glue, not a shifted motor, not a ripped or torn cone, not a jacked up spyder, not a bad surround, not a demagnetized motor, nothing. Only thing that will cause a burnt coil is misuse, whether its a clipped signal, or just flat out too much power. Since I was playing it for a bit with no problem on the AP 3k, I couldnt have been the subs fault. If it was the amp, radio, wiring, RCAs, etc that blew it, I am not liable. The speaker was wired correctly, and played wonderfully when it left here. Anything past that is Ds responsibility, since there was no problem with the sub at all.

I dealt with Mumbler when the first part happened. In the end, he sold a used sub, and I bought it as is. We hooked it up at first and it played fine for a bit, until problems started. We did quite a bit of playing it before it started rattling and sparking. Drew was there, he remembers how we played it fine at first.

Im accounted for, and Mumbler is accounted for. Only person with an obligation thats needs to be fulfilled is D.

Because Nick at IA is such a standup guy, youre even getting ANOTHER recone for the sub. Maybe third time is the charm. All youre paying in this entire event is materials for a box (which you were going to pay no matter what you bought, so it cant be counted), and $600 on a sub. You havent paid for a single recone, and dont have any money on the table that you werent expecting to. I was thinking of just taking the sub back, but I dont want to find another buyer and possibly wait another 2.5 months to get paid. I want my money for this sub now.

You made a deal with me, and Nick and myself have gone ABOVE AND BEYOND to help you out. Now I would like to recieve payment for the product that was delivered.

what are you talking about you have 200 of mine and thats not counting the box.

[Big D]

wow this blew up fast. Not my business but I'm still wondering about the recone, bad coil. There's been another member that had issues with IA Warden 21" recones, but it was tinsel leads breaking, not burnt coils. Can anyone confirm the actual condition of the coil? Maybe pics.

:confused:

[Big D]

Today, 02:20 PM
galacticmonkey
Senior Member
FloridaSPL Addict




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 7,825
Re: Yoooo

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I either want the sub back with a fresh recone, where you can have your money back.

Or ill take the blown sub back, in which case I'm keeping the $200 to cover the recone/labor/etc.

Third option is you pay me the last $400 for the sub and make good on the deal that we agreed upon months ago.

[Chuck]

yes i did with the understanding that the sub was 100% whats to say another recone won't go bad? then what im stuck?

It was 100% after the recone. It will only go bad if you blow another sub.

the subs has issues

The issue is the operator.

curious why a TEAM CAPTAIN would get this you got my number and we been pming all day....

Youre wondering why Id make a thread like this about a team captain? Youre not the captain to any team Im on. And we have been PMing for so long because you wont pay me.

the sub was put in my car played at 1/4 volume maybe 5 times and stopped working....no smelly coils. then i offered it as recone needed.

I gave it a good workout. Wanted to make sure everything was 100% functional. You were in the car playing it, then I got in the car and played it. We both thought it was fine. You even posted how great it was and how loud it was when you got home.

what are you talking about you have 200 of mine and thats not counting the box.

So now you expect poayment for the box that I built you for free?

And of course you have $200 laid out. If you buy a sub for $600, expect that youre going to pay money.

wow this blew up fast. Not my business but I'm still wondering about the recone, bad coil. There's been another member that had issues with IA Warden 21" recones, but it was tinsel leads breaking, not burnt coils. Can anyone confirm the actual condition of the coil? Maybe pics.

I thought it might have been a problem with the sub itself until Drew showed me a picture of the coil on his phone and it was clearly burnt. And the fact that it has no continuity doesnt help either. The real problem is, if it worked 100% when it got put in, he gets home, goes to shoot a video of it, and then calls me telling me it isnt working, and the coils end up being burnt.

It worked great, and then had a blackened coil. A sub cant blow itself.

[Big D]

your not a member of team under pressure??????????

[Chuck]

YES THERE ARE BAD RECOILS THIS IS WHY HES GETTING ANOTHER AND HOW COULD THE SUB BE PLAYING WHEN U FIRST PUT IT IN AND IT WAS SHOOTING SPARKS?


im trying to figure how that is D's fault and he still took the sub after he was convinced that it would work fine with a recone which it did not. And o yeah there are bad recones going around from IA thats certain.

It did work just fine with a recone. Check his build log thread where hes saying that its nasty loud for a trunk setup after he got the sub back in. Sub was 100% fine.

There is a possibility of a manufacturer defect. The same way that a Rolls Royce can roll off the production line and be a lemon. Things happen. But this wasnt a manufacturing defect or a bad sub. It is a blown coil. Unless IA stole his car after he said it was playing great, and fried the coil on his sub, Im failing to see how this is their fault. If anything, IA is stepping up and offering a recone even though its clearly not their fault.

[Big D]

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a117/lb187/Teambreakdown.jpg

[Chuck]

i saw the sub 1st hand not thru a pic that wasnt a normal blown coil i may not be a sub guru but i know electronics if that coil seperated from the cone it would spark and also why is there one particular spot thats burned and its lossened from the cone

The coil didnt seperate from the cone. And after the recone, there was no single burned spot. That was when we first put it in, on the first coil, then I paid for that recone.

After it was put back in, the ONLY point of failure was a toasted voice coil. The entire coil was burnt. The manufacturer couldnt cause that. Unless they intentionally blow recones before they ship them out, but that doesnt seem likely.

[Chuck]

No, Im not being on any team with you after pulling something like this.

And you might need to make some revisions to that chart pretty soon. :fyi:

Edit: Lulz, NT beat me to it. Ninja poast son!

[Big D]

no problem....everything i do for the team, yeah im a bad guy!

[Chuck]

no problem....everything i do for the team, yeah im a bad guy!

You have given me 3 Team Under Pressure pens. And I think I had a biscuit of yours from Popeyes at a show once.

Oh, and youre screwing me out of $400.

[Big D]

You have given me 3 Team Under Pressure pens. And I think I had a biscuit of yours from Popeyes at a show once.

Oh, and youre screwing me out of $400.

dude grow up and stop acting like a kid. Did you know the team host events now? How did u think we do that? Whens the last time you did anything for the team? Whens the last time you were in the lanes?

[Big D]

and you have 200 i gave you and a fresh reconed sub soon....whats the problem?

[Chuck]

dude grow up and stop acting like a kid. Did you know the team host events now? How did u think we do that? Whens the last time you did anything for the team? Whens the last time you were in the lanes?

I know you host events. You did it by calling Wayne and paying a fee. Its cool that you guys put on shows.

What do I have to "do" for the team? I am (was) good teammate and help out fellow teammates/friends. Like building you a box for free, or driving 75 minutes one way to run wire and install horns in your car, or letting you do a "payment plan" on a $600 speaker, or paying out of pocket to help a friend and make good on my word after the product wasnt as promised, or letting Evan make payments on the Selenium mids so he could get them in time for a show, or letting CJ have my alt to test fit and see it works before buying, or helping NT build his wall, or install or work on any of his systems, or tune his amps, or building Ryans wall two nights ago, or building boxes with Drew, or working on his car with him at my place, or shuttling amps back and forth to Steve for repair, or just generally hanging out with them and being friends with them outside of car audio, or even being the first member added to the team after Dave and Robert founded it, or even giving you my vote to bring you into the team?

In that case, I guess I havent done much at all. But I still dont see what this has to do with out deal?

You put on shows and are the "team captain", so you shouldnt have to pay me?

[Big D]

I know you host events. You did it by calling Wayne and paying a fee. Its cool that you guys put on shows.

What do I have to "do" for the team? I am (was) good teammate and help out fellow teammates/friends. Like building you a box for free, or driving 75 minutes one way to run wire and install horns in your car, or letting you do a "payment plan" on a $600 speaker, or paying out of pocket to help a friend and make good on my word after the product wasnt as promised, or letting Evan make payments on the Selenium mids so he could get them in time for a show, or letting CJ have my alt to test fit and see it works before buying, or helping NT build his wall, or install or work on any of his systems, or tune his amps, or building Ryans wall two nights ago, or building boxes with Drew, or working on his car with him at my place, or shuttling amps back and forth to Steve for repair, or just generally hanging out with them and being friends with them outside of car audio, or even being the first member added to the team after Dave and Robert founded it, or even giving you my vote to bring you into the team?

In that case, I guess I havent done much at all. But I still dont see what this has to do with out deal?

You put on shows and are the "team captain", so you shouldnt have to pay me?

gmonk what is this :

Today, 02:20 PM
galacticmonkey
Senior Member
FloridaSPL Addict




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 7,825
Re: Yoooo

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I either want the sub back with a fresh recone, where you can have your money back.

Or ill take the blown sub back, in which case I'm keeping the $200 to cover the recone/labor/etc.

Third option is you pay me the last $400 for the sub and make good on the deal that we agreed upon months ago.

[Chuck]

i know u want those new subs man this is wrong u never called me liek d said i SAW the sub i was there on the phone when the sub went out from the very beginning the sub had problems now u will get the sub back reconed and ur 200 was comped from what d gave u down where r u being screwed?

Why would I call you over a deal D and I made? And no, after the recone, the sub DID NOT HAVE PROBLEMS. Everyone on the defense keeps going back to that. But its just simply not true. Check his build log thread. Even he posted how great it was playing.

Nt u always said if there was a problem pick up the phone and call and we have tried that from g monk to you no ones picking up the phone to talk and on top of that were out 274 bucks on shirts so we can have all this happen.

We have tried to take it to a new level and now this quick to bail? no one conversating like men but u say honer a deal liek a man? wtf seriously...


NT and myself were just talking about this earlier. Youre still a good guy in my book, and I told you I would take a team shirt. You will have the money at the show, you have my word. It wouldnt be fair for me to say "Yeah, Ill take it" and then back out after the fact and leave you with it. Thats exactly whats happening to me. Feels pretty crappy doesnt it? But I assure you, you will be paid for my shirt. Im doing it because 1) its the right thing to do. 2) because youre a friend and I wouldnt do that to a friend. 3) if I didnt, that would be such hypocrisy.

Me and D have conversed on this subject for quite a while. I was perfectly calm, cool, and collective at first. Then after D refusing to accept even a shred of blame for a blown coil, and the possibility of my being stuck without a buyer for this sub, I got stressed. If a new level entitles members backing out of deals and leaving each other hanging, thats not the level Im on.

[Chuck]

gmonk what is this :

I either want the sub back with a fresh recone, where you can have your money back.

Or ill take the blown sub back, in which case I'm keeping the $200 to cover the recone/labor/etc.

Third option is you pay me the last $400 for the sub and make good on the deal that we agreed upon months ago.



Its the 10th time you have made that same exact post. I can read.

Third option is we made the deal, and you need to honor it. Can you read it?

[Big D]

I know you host events. You did it by calling Wayne and paying a fee. Its cool that you guys put on shows.

What do I have to "do" for the team? I am (was) good teammate and help out fellow teammates/friends. Like building you a box for free, or driving 75 minutes one way to run wire and install horns in your car, or letting you do a "payment plan" on a $600 speaker, or paying out of pocket to help a friend and make good on my word after the product wasnt as promised, or letting Evan make payments on the Selenium mids so he could get them in time for a show, or letting CJ have my alt to test fit and see it works before buying, or helping NT build his wall, or install or work on any of his systems, or tune his amps, or building Ryans wall two nights ago, or building boxes with Drew, or working on his car with him at my place, or shuttling amps back and forth to Steve for repair, or just generally hanging out with them and being friends with them outside of car audio, or even being the first member added to the team after Dave and Robert founded it, or even giving you my vote to bring you into the team?

In that case, I guess I havent done much at all. But I still dont see what this has to do with out deal?

You put on shows and are the "team captain", so you shouldnt have to pay me?

I gave you 150 for the trip to my house remember, i also did not use all the wood and wire and ring terminals remember i gave you that.

[Big D]

Monk.. get the sub back and ill give you the 400 you want... bam everybody can stfu

here we go where do you want it shipped?????

[Chuck]

I gave you 150 for the trip to my house remember, i also did not use all the wood and wire and ring terminals remember i gave you that.

That was for the purchase of the of the 1/0 and 2 horns I was seling you. And yes, there was scrap wood left over, and there were a few ring terminals left here.

Ill take the 5 ring terminals out of the equation. Now I just want $395 for the sub.

If Tripp wants the sub, great. Sell it to him. It will even have a new recone on it. You could sell it, keep it, or even use it as a boat anchor for all I care. I just want the rest of the cash for the sub. Im not looking to keep the sub and your money, im not looking to keep the sub, and Im not looking to see you screwed out of $200. I just want the deal to be completed as was agreed upon. Pay me for the sub, and then sell it to Tripp. I get paid, you hold good on your end of the deal and possibly make a buck, and he gets a sub at a good price. We all win.

[Big D]

That was for the purchase of the of the 1/0 and 2 horns I was seling you. And yes, there was scrap wood left over, and there were a few ring terminals left here.

Ill take the 5 ring terminals out of the equation. Now I just want $395 for the sub.

If Tripp wants the sub, great. Sell it to him. It will even have a new recone on it. You could sell it, keep it, or even use it as a boat anchor for all I care. I just want the rest of the cash for the sub. Im not looking to keep the sub and your money, im not looking to keep the sub, and Im not looking to see you screwed out of $200. I just want the deal to be completed as was agreed upon. Pay me for the sub, and then sell it to Tripp. I get paid, you hold good on your end of the deal and possibly make a buck, and he gets a sub at a good price. We all win.

ok so let him paypal you the cash and then ship it when the recone is done. Does that sound ok?

[Big D]

:pointnlaugh::pointnlaugh:

If you really want it, PM me. Ill let D slide on this if it will help you out.

you laugh....wow

[Big D]

Dude big D (chris) is a stand up guy. i know him personally ans woudl stake my name on the fact this was not intentional but a bad situation between teammates... this is what i was worried would happen in the beginning we dont have to let anger take control of us lets work this out as a TEAM.

Thanks, my question is now how is something like this fixed?:confused:

[Big D]

im out. no hard feelings

thats not what im talking about, but i do wish you well.

[Chuck]

I tried dealing with D. In the last 2 weeks we have had probably 5 phone calls and 80-100 pms. Nothing was being resolved. It isnt a team matter. Its a matter between D and myself. Team or no team, friend or no friend, if someone does this on a deal, theres a problem. I tried to solve things with him, but he would not finish the deal. Because I know there is no chance of him paying, I made a thread in the seller/buyer feedback section. Yeah, we were friends and teammates, but this was a business transaction and im not happy with D as a buyer to say the least. There has been damage done to your name, and there is no way to fix it. The only way to not have this happen is to keep your word. I think that I have a reputation as a good guy on the forums and in the car audio community in general. Thats because Ive been an active member on this and other forums, been to most shows, and been learning what I can and helping others for the last 1/4 of my life.

If things happen to the team because of it, Im sorry to all who did nothing to deserve it. Although I am the one who created the thread who started it, the thread was started because of the actions of D, and the team members who arent happy with this should talk to him about the collateral damage. Evan, you really are doing a lot of good for the team. I respect you for that. But when someone pulls something like D did, that hurts the reputation of the team. Nobody wants to associate with that. If it is shown that a teammate couldnt trust him to keep his word, why would Nobody Joe who has never met D trust him? Or have respect for him or the team? Actions like that are not representative of Team Under Pressure and why it was founded, or what its about. Thats why the oldest 1/2 of the team just left.

Just because we are on a team doesnt mean that Im going to get screwed on a trade. A deal was made, and I want to see it through.

Luckily, Tripp is interested. He says this sub will help him out, so Id rather see him get a deal on a sub, then force the issue with D. Now if for some reason he changes his mind, or cant buy the sub in the next few days, I will still expect full payment from D.

[Chuck]

seriously guys... wow

im trying to understand why the pms to d give him options but then u say thats not what you meant thats confusing me...

and as for the drama man i mean u say its not a team thing but here it goes now it seems to be falling apart i have tried so hard to put good things together.

I gave him the possible 3 ways to go about it. Then I told him which way I wanted it to go. The way we mutually agreed upon.

If the things are "falling apart" its because of Ds actions, not because of me bringing them to light. Im sorry, but Im not going to lay down on a deal just to save the reputation of the guy thats causing me the problem.

It would be the same as if a guy was to cheat on his wife, then his friend told his wife that her husband was cheating on her. The friends mouth didnt cause the divorce, it was caused by the actions of the husband. The friend just let the truth come to the light.

The truth is the truth. Let the cards fall as they will.

[Chuck]

but the truth is all options were not discussed both parties believe there right and there are so many ways it could have been resolved other than this.

Other options were discussed, and thats not the route I would like to take. Even if there were more options possible, it does not matter because it takes two parties to make an agreement. It also takes two parties to nullify or change the stipulations of an agreement. In this case, there was an original deal made, one party wants it changed/nullified, and the other wants it seen through as agreed upon. Am I wrong?

Even then, being a so called "friend" or "teammate", he shouldnt try to back out of an agreement. Thats what shady Ebay buyers and Nigerian bank scammers do. Not "friends". If D was a true friend or teammate, or even an honorable man, he would stick to his word and protect not only our friendship, but his integrity, but that of the team's.

D gave me his word, but apparently thats worthless.

[Big D]

Thanks again for the support. Alot of people posting dont know the whole story even Robin said hes never seen anything like this with the sub, i was promised a New like sub i hardly think that meens after being played a few times i shorts out...Robin even said on his 21s he had a 20.1 on ea coil clipping for 45mins and this didnt happen. I only had an ap3k on it played it 6 times 1/4 volume not clippin and robin said even if it was it wouldnt cause that. Chuck stated several options but he really only wanted one option MONEY and with that sub having the same issues like it did the 1st time. I will not loose anymore money on this. We were going to see everyone sunday why did it come to this. I got screwed before by a team mate i didnt bring it to open fourms and fyi the box chuck built is not 7cubes...

[Big D]

ok then. looks like an unbiased mediator is in order.

good idea but this should have been done face to face or via phone.

[Chuck]

The sub was reconed and was perfectly fine. He got what he was supposed to. The sub was fine. The fact of the matter is it's a blown coil. That's not a manufacturer defect. That's user error. It WAS defective, then reconed and was perfectly good.

Face to face won't change anything. It's the same person and he didn't want to work with me. Is it wrong that I wanted money? It is what we agreed upon because I wanted money. When I sell something, it's usually because I want money for it. That's what we both agreed upon. Is that so wrong?

Either way, I'm tired of this whole situation. I knew D wasn't going to keep his word, so I made this thread to let people see it. It's done, it's over. The facts are out there. People will read it and decide for themselves. If I'm wrong at all, it will reflect upon me in the future.

[Big D]

I think Robin should post his finding cause i was told something else on the phone by him.

[Big D]

i still see the finger being pointed at everyon else, could the sub just not have been blown? how is it just not possible? you guys keep saying there is all this evidence but wont present it....

it made the same tappin sound it did that night we 1st hooked it up 2.5 months ago and then silence.

[Big D]

Whats so wrong with saying double check the box too?? mistakes can happen.

yeah the box is not 7cubes and i see a few gaps i guess where the liquid nails didnt hold.

[Big D]

i shouldn't say anything at this point but i will , being someone who knows how to recone a woofer and have done plenty of them ..... The only things i can think of that would cause sparks is extreme coil rub there are so many things that could cause coil rub we would be here all day and still not uncover the cause the possibilities are endless , but at the end of the day the facts are simple the sparks are caused by coil rub . As far as what is going on, all parties involved need to sit down and discuss a solution that is reasonable to all noone else needs to be involved this is a solution that can be resolve this whole ordeal , just sit down and talk is any one getting anywhere by this besides losing respect for one another ??? ALL THIS DRAMA NEEDS TO STOP

your right, the drama needs to stop and those that dont want to respect team captains it would be best if they leave the team and others who want to follow them~go

[Big D]

respect is earned, it didnt come with the posissition....

i guess bigdave thought i had respect when he turned the team over to me.

[Chuck]

lets not get robin involved. honestly

When the very 1st time the sub was played it was defective...

where you wrong in demanding money... yes. You dont know what could have happened if you talked face to face you never even gave him the option. Grown men act like grown men and talk and mediate. obviously from the moment that sub was put in that box and it was sparking the original deal was not in place.


And honestly it was a great thing u guys worked into the night to see the sub was bad, if not no sparks would have been seen at all. D would have rode off with a "great playing sub" just to get down the road and pow go out. so honestly man new recone or no recone he payed 200 bucks down on a blown sub and 150+ on materials for a box.

D went foward because he was told a recone would fix it. But what if it didnt?
What if its reconed again and the same thing? then whose to blame?

Im wrong in expecting him to pay for something he is buying for me? It was defective at first. I paid for a recone to make it right. The $200 D gave me wasnt for the recone. It was for the sub. I was paying for it out of pocket. I did not expect D to pay for the recone. I was still going to get $600, minis $150 I paid on the recone. So I was getting $450.

Forget the box material cost. Whether he ran 10000 21s or 1 8, whether I built it, a shop built it, or he built it himself, the materials were going to cost money.

There were sparks that night. The sub was playing fine the very first night for a while. We played some songs, tested it out a little bit. Then D proceeded to crank it up with the trunk open. The sub was bottoming out and distorting to hell. That could have caused the problem originally, but whether it did or not, I did not want to risk my reputation on it. After it distorted and bottomed out because he decided to play it loud with the trunk open, then the buzzing noise started, and after playing a few more songs, the fireworks began. Drew was there and could vouch for that. When D opened his trunk to play his AP 15s, he ended up launching a coil through the cone. When he called me to tell me it wasnt working, he said he was shooting a video of the sub with the trunk open to post on the forum. But why would he turn it up at all on a video to show excursion or flex? Everyone who takes a video of their system to show off plays it at 10% of max volume. :rolleyes2:

And the moment it was sparking, the original deal was not in place. So I paid for a recone, and held my end. It played fine at my house, and the rest of that day and night. It was fine the whole next day until he was shooting a video with his trunk open. You talk about grown men. A grown man would accept responsibility responsibility for his actions, and stay true to his word. That is a man with a backbone.

It was reconed, and it did fix it. There is no WHAT IF. It was fixed, and was essentially a brand new subwoofer. If it happened again, wouldnt that just prove even more its user error?

i mean how long did he have it

Mumbler? Not sure.

D? It played for like 15 mins the first night. Then it played for 2 days the second time.

yes he played it for chuck and had no problems and chuck played it on his home stereo and no problems but when he put it in the box he built me which is not 7cubes~sparks flew!

Get your story straight. No, Mumbler never played the sub for me. I played it on my HT amp and it was fine. Go measure it, and tell me how big the box is. Do you even know the equation for finding airspace? If its not 7 cubes, go measure it and tell me exactly how big it is.

I would give you your money back on the box, but I didnt charge you anything in the first place. Dont insult my work unless you have a reason to do so. Not because "The box might not even be right!".


thats another thing that box is it possible a mistake could have been made at all? when i pulled the sub out of his trunk i looked at it are u guys sure its 7 cubes?

The box is fine. Go measure it and find the airspace yourself. It may be a couple tenths off possibly, but for starting in the morning and doing the design/build/install in a single day, Im happy with the way it turned out. I wish I would have had more time to make it look nicer and cleaner, but D had to have it in his car that day, because if he didnt, the world was going to come to an end. So I dont charge him for it, he rushes me, and then insults my work?

Even if the box was way off, it still doesnt change the fact that D got a working sub and blew it on his own time.

[Chuck]

Things were talked out. D would not hold his end of the bargain. Evan, you arent his mom. You arent his dad. This deal does not concern you or anybody else.

D is not a man of his word, and wont accept the responsibility for his actions. Its clearly just a sub blown my abuse. That is not even up for debate. Its his fault it doesnt work.

After D told me straight out that he would not pay me for the product, I decided to post this. If he is this kind of person, I want everybody to know.

It does make him look bad. That was the point of posting this here. He did not hold his end of the deal, which is wrong. Im just letting people know what kind of person he is.

[Chuck]

your right, the drama needs to stop and those that dont want to respect team captains it would be best if they leave the team and others who want to follow them~go

If you want the drama to stop, put an end to it. Complete the deal as agreed upon. This whole thing blew up because of YOUR actions, not mine.

As NT said, respect is earned. And after seeing this, I have absolutely no respect for D at all.

[Big D]

If you want the drama to stop, put an end to it. Complete the deal as agreed upon. This whole thing blew up because of YOUR actions, not mine.

As NT said, respect is earned. And after seeing this, I have absolutely no respect for D at all.

but you would respect me if i gave you money. No bigboi is speaking what he knows cause were the team captains and friends and we talk like grown men, you should try it sometime. Whys Nt seem to post about your stuff? Is he your mom or dad? Chuck you acted like a brat when i wouldnt go w/option 3 and give you money. This should not have been handeled this way PERIOD!

[Chuck]

but you would respect me if i gave you money. No bigboi is speaking what he knows cause were the team captains and friends and we talk like grown men, you should try it sometime. Whys Nt seem to post about your stuff? Is he your mom or dad? Chuck you acted like a brat when i wouldnt go w/option 3 and give you money. This should not have been handeled this way PERIOD!

So its all my fault because I expected you to pay for a product we made a deal on? If you were a man with a backbone, you would know that you were binded to option 3 when you shook on the deal.

At this point, deal or no deal, Ill have no respect for you. But if the deal gets closed, the dispute will be over.

[Big D]

So its all my fault because I expected you to pay for a product we made a deal on? If you were a man with a backbone, you would know that you were binded to option 3 when you shook on the deal.

At this point, deal or no deal, Ill have no respect for you. But if the deal gets closed, the dispute will be over.

the dispute is over.

[Chuck]

The deal has been completed?

[Big D]

Ok im going to be the bigger man here and dispite all the disrespectful things said and things twisted...the basic drama. Chuck you will get 400 when i get the new reconed sub from Robin, i am putting a buyer on this today. Now that being said i think thats fair. If you have any questions or problems with this please pm or call me.

[Chuck]

This was not resolved. Big D again told me hes done, and its over. Im chalking it up to experience. Continuing this is not worth the stress it causes. Ill count my losses, and deal with it myself.